What happens when a PhD philosopher who spent four years in the ether of academic concepts decides the abstract world isn't enough — and ends up defending people accused of murder in Albuquerque, New Mexico, with an in-house therapist as his business partner? In this episode of the Trustcast Show, Zane Myers speaks with Maxwell Pines, founder of Max Pines Law, about the journey from a Brown University dissertation on how humans understand their own actions to 86-plus trials and 10 homicide cases as a public defender, and why he finally launched his own firm with something almost no other law office has. Max shares the story of Matthew Chavez, who was convicted of murder, sentenced to 23 years, and acquitted eight years later in a retrial after a key witness had a religious conversion and recanted, and how that kind of case lives with you forever whether you win or lose. They also discuss why philosophy and criminal law are closer than most people think, what it means to cross-examine a witness who you know is lying, how having a licensed clinical social worker specializing in trauma built into his firm changes what he can offer clients, and the civil rights case he's now building against a deputy with a record of killing three people who shot his surrendering client with a foam pellet in the back. Maxwell Pines is the founder of Max Pines Law in Albuquerque, New Mexico, a criminal defense and civil rights firm. He holds a PhD in philosophy from Brown University and a JD from UC Berkeley School of Law. Connect with Maxwell Pines: maxpineslaw.com max@maxpineslaw.com Phone: 505-226-2249 Facebook and LinkedIn: Maxwell Pines Albuquerque, New Mexico Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Maxwell Pines 00:54 The Thanksgiving conversation that made him realize academics wasn't enough 02:13 Switching advisors and finishing the dissertation while leaving for law school 03:36 The dissertation advisor confrontation and what it took to get out 05:36 From philosophy to public defender — was he prepared for what that actually meant 06:49 The through line between philosophy and criminal defense 08:47 What homicide trials feel like when your client's life is literally on the line 11:00 Winning big and losing hard — the weight of a client who's in prison for life 14:06 The Matthew Chavez case — convicted of murder, acquitted in a retrial eight years later 16:30 Why the witness lied in the first trial and what changed his mind 18:51 How lying witnesses get exposed and why the adversarial system works 20:36 What made 2024 the year to leave the public defender and start his own firm 23:18 The civil rights cases he's now building and what they look like 25:10 How someone gets pulled over for a car they actually own 28:16 How speaking fluent Spanish changes the attorney-client relationship 29:23 The in-house therapist — his wife Jeanette and the trauma-informed model 30:47 Rapid fire — Kant or Wittgenstein 31:44 Hardest part of law school after a PhD 32:34 Best meal in Albuquerque 36:25 How to reach Maxwell Pines #MaxwellPines #MaxPinesLaw #CriminalDefense #CivilRights #AlbuquerqueAttorney #PhilosopherLawyer #HomicideTrial #TrustcastShow #PublicDefender #TraumaInformedLaw
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